Steels that can be high in edge retention and toughness are desirable for general use knives. I am just grasping at straws here, but from the data you shared, it seems like toughness does increase faster than edge retention decreases: it is harder to get a very high edge retention knife that will still be somewhat tough compared to a very tough knife that will still hold an edge ok. 2. Get for a complete guide about other steel; you can read 14c28n vs 8cr13mov reviews. Ive not seen these used on non-kitchen knives, though, and it seems that if they had real utility they would be used in other knives as well although perhaps on the thinner edges of kitchen knives they are more effective than they would be elsewhere? n690 Its hard to imagine a more rust-inducing environment than saltwater and fish guts. Properties: 14C28N: D2: Edge retention: 4/10: 7/10: Ease of sharpening: 6/10: 3/10: Corrosion resistance: 4/10: 4/10: Toughness: D2 is carbon steel that has high toughness and durability. Most low alloy tool steels and carbon steels also have fine carbide structures without powder metallurgy processing. EDGE RETENTION . 440A . It doesnt hold an edge well, but its so easy to sharpen that you can get it back to razor sharpness in a few minutes. A mirror finish is the best at resisting corrosion and a rough finish means rust and corrosion is more likely. But as the market has grown and newer steels have come out, it has fallen in price and prestige. nevertheles its importand to keep in mind what exactly is going on there (abrasive plastic media, loss of most of cutting ability during the first few strokes etc.). 14C28N steel, also known as Sandvik 14C28N, is stainless steel made by Sandvik, a European steel company in Sweden. Thanks in advance, Simon, For hard use everyday cutting in a packing company, Everything from fome, cardboard, tape, thick plastics, And plastic wrap that is against metal. 1. Been here before? The sharpening makes the knives easy to maintain because they dull faster and require frequent sharpening. You can see that 64 Rc AEB-L has both lower toughness and edge retention than 61 Rc MagnaCut, so I feel that in general you get a better sense of where the steels fit with a single point. Often used for combat knives. The knife does dull faster. D2 is a high carbon, high chromium die steel and is the highest carbon alloy tool and die steel typically used in knife making. Carbon steels are those that have primarily carbon added to them with some Mn or Si as well. Other factors that can be added in are corrosion resistance, hardness, and cost. What is pulling that line high and to the right? Toughness 3, Edge Ret 8, Cor Res 4? 1060 9cr18MOV or D2? | BladeForums.com But it would be my recommendation for applications requiring extreme corrosion resistance. Note:Dont bother with anything less than 8Cr in this series. For example, below is a video comparing a 1095 ESEE knife at 55-57 Rc and a MagnaCut knife at 62.5 Rc, both with the same edge angle. Water is a severe quenchant that can often lead to warping or cracking. The ultra high corrosion resistance steels Vanax or LC200N max out around 60-61 Rc instead. The best knife for you should meet your needs and fit your budget. . PESR would be an interesting topic too (also tied to LC200N). . But among the steels youll find at Cabelas and the like, this is a pretty good choice. They were two different tests (different batch of steel, different person heat treating, etc). in relation to hardness). We and our partners use cookies to Store and/or access information on a device. 14C28N VS D2 Attributes: 14c28n: D2 . But its very cheap, and, when ground appropriately, it can be a real winner from a value standpoint. I was recommended the Rat 1 in D2 and I also found that I really like the design of the Ruike p135 and p128. Sharpening the knives might be challenging, but the D2 knife is high quality and affordable. Its not a particularly great cutter, being poor at retaining an edge. If you purchase this types of knife, without any hassle you can easily re-sharpening. This is the steel used in Swiss Army knives and is excellent for beginner sharpeners. In other words, heat treating a steel to its maximum hardness does not necessarily mean reduced corrosion resistance. Honestly, yes, because its perfect steel for your knife, besides it depends on which knife, so when youre talking about chef knives, then 14c28n would be an ideal pick thanks to professional corrosion resistance and edge retention. Hit like and all t. HAP40 Thanks for the Article Larrin, H2 Thanks again for everything you're doing, it's a tremendous resource. After the steel is quenched it is reheated to a lower temperature to increase toughness and decrease hardness. Thank you for putting this together, incredibly useful! Marco, BSc Chem. 14C28N is essentially AEB-L (or perhaps more accurately Sandvik 13C26), but with improved corrosion resistance. edge retention can vary by several orders of magnitude depending on what happens to the burr. You showed some pictures in this article of the effect on what we might call "effective toughness" of thinner edge angles vs thicker edges in the same steel at the same hardness. its like with cars, most of them are not a corvette or a porsche. 14C28N vs D2: Which Steel Is Better? - Knifeful.com Low Carbon steels like AEB-L wont hold up to wood cutting even though it can hit 64 hard, it just doesnt have enough Carbon. I wont go into detail about those here. It mainly made for knife and it high in Chromium for excellent corrosion resistance. quite possibly the best steel youll find on a sub-$30 production knife. Not impractical fantasy knives, but these two knives that have a col look to them. And Ive done a lot of experimental work on knife steels where I feel more confident in my own ratings. Theyre excellent for choppers, hard-use folders, and outdoor knives that see impacts and heavy use when used at medium hardness. Hi there, Its very hard, tough, and corrosion-resistant. The edge retention numbers are normalized to the hardness of the closest toughness test. 52100 I couldnt find much on 5160 steel and from a knife makers point of view if you are saying youre the preferred supplier of special ops than I dont understand this choice in knife steel. Vanadium carbides are very large with conventional production of steels but are very small with powder metallurgy. (I think the 420HC estimate in that post was based on simulation or computer modeling, since you didnt spray testing any of the 400 series.) A2 is a tool steel renowned for toughness. 14c28n vs d2 - Which Model For Best - Knifeyellowpages Below shows a comparison of carbide structure between D2 and CPM-D2, and then toughness measurements between the conventional and PM versions of CruWear, D2, and 154CM. Knifemakers use dozens of steel types to create knife blades. There you said 7.6 for 420HC. The main downside is the steel is more difficult to heat treat and cant go harder than about 60 or perhaps 61 Rc. Therefore, you cannot purchase the knife for use in corrosive environments. The maximum edge retention available in this group is not particularly high because most of the wear resistance comes from iron carbide, also called cementite, which is the softest of the different carbide types. Steels with very high vanadium content like Vanadis 8, CPM-10V, K390, CPM-15V, etc. Let the job at hand be your guide. Its an update of its 12C27 and 13C26 steels, which were developed for use in shaving razors. The 10V specimens tempered at 1000F were 4-5 ft-lbs while the specimens tempered at 4-500F were 7-8 ft-lbs. Is this at the same hardness? Most of the discussion of how the ratings were generated, various caveats and details, etc. 14c28n vs d2 : r/chineseknives - reddit Later, it gets heated and compressed into one ingot. Powder metallurgy steels with low vanadium content like CPM-1V and Z-Tuff/CD#1 have extremely high toughness. at least it has some vanadium over the 420hc. S45VN Below I have shown the difference in carbide volume between AEB-L, CPM-10V, and Rex 121 to get an idea of how much more carbide there is in the high edge retention steels. And given the recipe, it has a low number of carbides, the extra-hard microcrystals in steel that provide the hardness necessary for a stable and sharp edge. Socould you please clarify which steel is the outlier and which is the line>. Vanax gives up some toughness and hardness vs MagnaCut for saltwater levels of corrosion resistance. Its not a regression line, it is just a line through the best steels. On the other hand, Speed safe assisted opening allows for easy blade deployment with the use of a simple pull back on the ambidextrous flipper. Divers, sailors, and anglers need knives that will resist corrosion above all else. also the angle is by far the most important factor in catra testing, so such results might be irrelevant. I always thought VG10 to be way more chippy/less tough compared cpms45vn. The solid lockup and decent blade design make these two knives well suited for camping. There are significant differences between them because 14C28N is stainless steel, while D2 steel is a semi-stainless tool steel. Having 1.5% Carbon does that. We all have our preference, but overall, preference leans towards the pocket knife with a clip. There is buzz out there but I havent seen anything solid yet in the world of steel. . It can dull your edge, cause pitting, and damage the structural integrity of your knife. and corrosion resistance than the 420HC steel. Editors note: This article was first published in May 2015 and was most recently updated on May 25, 2020. we dont know. Theres also a line of green triangles a bit below that. Thank you for the accurate data. Corrosion Resistance: D2 steel has a higher chromium content than 8Cr13MoV, which makes it better at resisting corrosion and wear. Compare 20 Grades of Knife Steel - ThoughtCo Which knife for best? Some of our partners may process your data as a part of their legitimate business interest without asking for consent. Dr. Thomas is a friend of ours here at Blade HQ, and with his help, weve worked to create this knife steel guide. Who looking for latest, high carbon, then the Kershaw Natrix Copper Pocketknife. Custom maker Brian Trudeau uses Nitro V, and Massdrops Perpetua design is the first production knife to sport it. This steel, as the name implies has a professional styling to it. But weve tested this metal in the form of the Sobata 398 for nearly a year and have been continually impressed. We did the research to help you find the best hunting knife for your needs and budget. 14C28N knives will handle challenging and demanding applications without chipping, cracking, or breaking. Micarta Though the volume of carbonitrides in the steel is relatively high. It shows 3 stainless steels from 750-800tcc but the edge retention graph only has 1 SS in that range, S90v. Required fields are marked *. This is an American-made powder steel. I am particularly interested in researching knife steel, knife properties, and brands. Vanax and LC200N are unique in reaching 59-60 Rc while being very stain resistant. My test is for comparing different steels, not necessarily for a go/no go test for saltwater applications. I was struggling to simplify all the Rockwell/Youngs Modulus stuff for readers when I came across your site. I think you wrote an article a bit ago on CTS-XHP and concluded that like D2 and ZDP-189 it wasnt really stainless (although stainless is a somewhat arbitrary line). The most balanced is CPM-MagnaCut which is in an area all by itself on the chart. One important concept I want to hammer home is that there isnt one property that is most important. Corrosion is not only cosmetic. Its a very hard steel and is exceptionally difficult to sharpen. Non-stainless steels can be heat treated to 66 Rc or even higher depending on the particular steel. The Complete Guide to Knife and Tool Steels - Heinnie Haynes Maxamet and Rex 121 are so extreme in terms of wear resistance and edge retention that I rated them higher than 10 because otherwise it throws off the ratings for everything else. This isnt exactly how steel works; different properties are difficult to increase without affecting something else. 1% saltwater will separate between other stainless steels. I tested its edge wear resistance but not its toughness yet. This is a major tradeoff between improved cutting ability and edge retention with an acute angle vs a strong and chip resistant edge with an obtuse angle. I was wondering if the 14c28n sample was also prequenched like the AEB-L toughness samples? Looks like there is no reason to us it over 420HC. Heat treatment and edge geometry can mean more for knife performance than the specific steel used in the knife. Steels that are higher in hardness and wear resistance are usually lower in toughness. High wear resistance is not particularly necessary when only performing chopping, and its good ease in sharpening helps when having to restore the edges. just recently the idea occured tome to sharpen a planer blade like a knife and check out how it performs. https://i0.wp.com/knifesteelnerds.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/10/stainless-toughness-10-19-21.jpg?w=757&ssl=1 Read about my tests in this article. Im looking forward to seeing if it does as well in full production. 14C28N and D2 steel are not the same. Edge Retention Test! 14c28n vs VG10 blade steel comparison - YouTube However, in our testing there is a reduction in toughness by using the high temperature range rather than the low temperature range, such as was found with CPM-CruWear (Z-Wear) or CPM-10V. I believe they are made of simple carbon steel. I see tables that compare Toughness,Edge Retention,Corrosion Resistance. I used to work for a company that did reclaimed old growth lumber (swamp cedar, old growth pine and oak beams, etc) and we went through planer blades twice as fast as the cabinetry shop next door (turns out the neighbors like it when you put all the loud businesses together and far away), which mostly cut fresh cherry, oak, maple, hickory etc. Only a skilled blacksmith can make Damascus steels, so they tend to be expensive. AEB-L and 14C28N are the best in the high toughness group. For example, increasing edge retention from Z-Tuff to 3V (100 mm in the CATRA test) led to a drop in over 10 ft-lbs, a similar drop is seen by going from 3V to CPM-CruWear. Sandvik 14C28N steel is better than D2 steel in corrosion resistance and toughness. You also reported 8.6 for 440A in that post, compared to 8.5 in this post. 2. It was originally developed for use as ball-bearing steel by NASA. there seems to be an optimal procedure for every alloy (provided its heat treated to industial standards). D2 is another medium-range tool steel. What it is: 14C28N is a Sandvik stainless steel commonly used in razors and kitchen knives. Everyone has their own opinion on what they deem the best folding EDC knife. Now that we know what each factor represents, we can see how the steels rank against one another. But unlike most high-end steels, SPY27 is an easily user-serviceable powder steel. Its very corrosion-resistant and quite tough. Its so high in hardness that Maxamet knives usually ship with desiccating packages. 14c28n has less carbon and chromium as compared to 9Cr steel. Therefore powder metallurgy is not necessary for certain steels, or could even be slightly detrimental. 420HC, 420, and 5160 all offer off-the-charts toughness. Alloying elements are an important ingredient vital in getting the best steel for the job. Blue Super and 1.2562 have higher edge retention but relatively low toughness. If youre looking for all all-around best knife steel, youd be hard-pressed to find one better than Bohler Uddeholm M390. Most steels use carbon to increase hardness, but 14C28N uses nitrogen, boosting hardness without the normal penalty of increased corrosion. D2 steel is more durable than 14C28N, but it scores lower in terms of ease of sharpening and corrosion resistance. If you want for best steel 14c28n and others steel then you can ready 14c28n vs 420hc review. Generally seen as a slight upgrade to the 440C/VG-10/ATS-34 caliber of steel, its a decent all-around steel with good corrosion resistance, decent toughness, and only modest hardness. All three of these steels havechromium, molybdenum, vanadium, and tungsten components and will perform well in myriad tasks. Rex 45 It also improves edge retention and strength. This is a non-powder steel produced by American steel company Carpenter. GearJunkie Copyright 2013 2023. 1095. I cant seem to match steel to the SS data points on the toughness/tcc graph. The majority of knives target 63 Rc or below so this limitation of stainless steels does not always come into play but can be an important factor for certain knives targeting high performance and thin edges. 440B Is there a reason SG2/R2 are not included in the lineup, despite being one of the most popular ones? Rex 121 23.5% vanadium carbide, 4% molybdenum/tungsten carbide (M6C), Conventional Ingot vs Powder Metallurgy Carbide Structure. Less expensive, conventionally produced steels include VG-10, D2, 154CM, N690, and 440C. These properties make steel a good choice for making kitchen, fishing, and everyday knives. Are you looking for 14c28n steel with other steel? The heat treatment techniques used by the manufacturer as well as the design of the blade itself play a huge role in the ultimate outcome of knife performance! This makes it a great choice if you don't have . The very good toughness of MagnaCut meant that it didnt chip despite this relatively high hardness and the difficulty of the test. It has a lower hardness and edge retention as compared to the 9Cr knife. Pretty interesting that regrinding a knife you already have can seemingly take its performance to that of significantly better steels. Hammering through hickory, digging at roots in sandy soil, and cutting around bone did nothing to chip, dent, or roll the edge of my 3V knives. Steel softens as tempering temperature increases, but certain steels see an increase in hardness in a certain higher temperature range such as shown below for high speed steels that are designed for this type of tempering: This high temperature tempering can be done for several reasons, such as better resistance to overheating during grinding, or because a coating will be applied to the knife that requires a high temperature.